Old(er) horse, out of shape - treat as if green?

[RioG]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#  If one has an older horse who is out of shape due to lack of formal exercise and some soundness issues (ongoing, but under control) is it beneficial to treat them as if green?  Basically start for scratch and not be demanding in what you are asking for during the ride?#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#One example is the canter.  Due to problems with balance, lack of condition and the soundness problems, the canter is extremely stiff, unbalanced and pretty much terrible when tracking left.  It is worse with a rider than on the longe.  Is it okay to let her "away" with some things until she regains her fitness level?  Or should I be more demanding of her because of her age and her "knowledge level"?#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Hopefully this makes sense.  Writing between working!#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Chisholm]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Well with any horse old or young coming back from a injury, I do a lot of walk work, building up to short amounts of trot work over a few weeks, to steady trot work, and when comfortable in trot ask for canter.  #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Maybe try cantering the horse on a lunge first after the horse is in a bit better condition.  Light lunging before a ride can also help an older horse limber up some.  Best to lunge the older horse in side reins to help them balance better.  Some older horses tend to fall on their forehand easily.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#But my other question would be what is the soundness issue.  Can the horse be on a small amount of bute on a regular basis for arthritis?#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Also I would check the saddle if the horse is really out of condition then a saddle that might have fit before doesn't fit now because there is no muscle over the back.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Hope that helps.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Judy F]

It's not necessary to treat it as green (ie: untrained).  It will remember everything ever taught and respond to the aids.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
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Your problem is conditioning.  Lots of walk and trot work, hacking
on slopes and hills, long straight lines, etc to get it's muscles
working and improve its heart and lung function.  #ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
You will need to spend at least several weeks at this before you can
really start on suppleness and balance, working slowly in big circles
at first.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
I would avoid longing as much as possible because it can overstress the
hocks.  A small amount of bute (usually 1 gm for 5 days, off for
2, repeat) can really help with arthritic horses and mild navicular
(which is often but not always, arthritis of the foot bones).#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
Patience, low level work and persistence will pay off.  #ed_op#br#ed_cl#

[Piaffing]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#This is just a fitness level issue. Within 6 weeks the horse should have a good degree of fitness back if being ridden about 5 times a week. Slowly make the workouts longer and harder. You will be amazed at how fast they come back.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Keetee]

How you fit up a horse really depends on why it was off.  Your vet
will be able to give you some advice.  I have fitted up two horses
after total layoff.  One was a mare that had damaged her cruciant
(sp?) ligament.  Because hers was a ligament problem, we were
advised by the vet to avoid circles and corners for 6 weeks.  We
ended up walking (and then trotting) in straight lines down the road
for 6 weeks.  After that we slowly started ring work, adding in
circles slowly.  #ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
The other horse was my gelding who was on stall rest from a broken leg
for about 6 months.  We started by hand walking, then walking
under saddle and after about a week of that we started adding in very
short periods (about 2 min) of trot.  We only did circles with him
after it felt like he could carry himself reasonably well on  a
straigth line and through shallow corners but that was definitely
before the end of 6 weeks.  He was showing at Medium 2 in the
summer, broke his leg in Sept, started being fitted up again in about
Feb and was back showing in May.  We took things very slowly at
first, making sure he had the muscle to support himself before doing
any sitting trot or canter.  #ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
I think the general rule of thumb is that it takes twice as long to fit
up a horse (or athlete) as it does to let them down.  If your
horse wasn't off for long and was fit before, it should take less time
than if he was off and lost all his muscle.  Watch your horse's
breathing rate and pay close attention to how he feels when you are
riding him and the day after (look for swelling, heat in legs, pain
over back muscles, etc.).  Lungeing is very hard on them so I tend
to avoid it unless they are reasonably fit.  It is best if you can
do some work with them 5- 6 times per week and that they get plenty of
turnout.  Overall, follow the advice of your vet and watch your
horse carefully for signs of stress.  #ed_op#br#ed_cl#

[luvr]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl#I'm not really sure if it'll help much but I ran across an article about stretching older horses a lil while ago and your post reminded me of it so I went and found the link again:#ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl##ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl##ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#A href="http://equisearch.com/care/senior/care041503/"#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #0000ff" face=Verdana color=#00ffff#ed_cl#Stretching#ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl##ed_op#/A#ed_cl##ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl##ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl#And another article that sounds more related to your original question:#ed_op#BR#ed_cl##ed_op#BR#ed_cl##ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl##ed_op#A href="http://equisearch.com/care/senior/eqaging2453/"#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #0000ff" face=Verdana color=#40ffff#ed_cl#Older Horse Fitness Stuff#ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl##ed_op#/A#ed_cl##ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl##ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#FONT face=Verdana#ed_cl#Hope that helps at least a bit #ed_op#IMG src="http://forums.equestrianconnection.com/richedit/smileys/Happy/3.gif"#ed_cl##ed_op#/FONT#ed_cl##ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Leena]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#On any horse out of shape, I would start by lungeing the horse. Atlanta equine clinic has 2 nice programs; one is base on 30 days and the other one on 60 days training. Both starts by 20 minutes walk.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#I have tried the 30 days program and it really work well on a stallion out of shape with imbalance at canter. I did lunge him for 2 weeks with a lots of transitions trot-canter to fix imbalance.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#When the fitness program is done, your horse is back to where he was before. I understand he had an injury or some kinds of problems so you might go slowly and supervise any signs of pain.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Here is the website link to Atlanta Equine Clinic:#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#A href="http://www.atlantaequine.com/pages/client_lib.html"#ed_cl#http://www.atlantaequine.com/pages/client_lib.html#ed_op#/A#ed_cl##ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Good luck and have fun !#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Leena#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Patricia]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#I certainly would not treat it as green.  They say trot is the gait to best get a horse fit.  So lots of walk/trot....endless transitions to develop the hind quarters to support itself and develop self carriage.  If he is weak at the canter maybe only canter on the lunge in the beginning.  I certainly would not back off.  He needs a program of regular work to get him back to his former self.  Enjoy the journey!#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[RioG]

#ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Wow, great responses, thank you.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#The darn bute debate... she is a 13 y.o. mare with navicular who does much, much better when worked on a regular basis.  I do confess to giving her bute once in a while, though always hesitate to tell people that due to the flack that is forthcoming.  I've almost reached the decision to just keep her on 1/2 gram/day though (advised by a vet long ago to keep her on 1 gram per day) along with the other supplements so that we can ride without me feeling guilty.  She is far from finished, this girl has way too much spunk in her to just leave her be for good.  And, she's the only horse I have so I have to work with what I've got!#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#The saddle issue... it was recently brought to my attention that her saddle does have some fitting issues.  Terrible I know, but that never even occurred to me to check.  Makes complete sense though, lack of back muscle equals incorrect saddle fit.  Is there anything I can do to help without buying a new saddle? (not in the cards right now).#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#So, if I am to set myself out a schedule to get her fitted back up, would it be advisable to stick to walk/trot for 4-6 weeks until her fitness and balance come back?  I had a lesson not too long ago and learned some great new exercises and just simply got some help in this new discipline, so I feel confident we could achieve the balance on our own (unless I'm out to lunch).  What about a program of 10-15 min. on the lunge to warm her up, then work our way up to 60 min. of riding?  Is that too ambitious?#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#And to the poster who suggested older horse fall on the forehand all too easily... this poor girl has had 12 years of falling on her forehand.  I agree that with her age she's gotten worse.#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl# #ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl##ed_op#DIV#ed_cl#Stretching also does wonders for this mare.  Thanks for the reminder!#ed_op#/DIV#ed_cl#

[Judy F]

Okay, Navicular.  For some, navicular &/or bute are up there with Lord Voldemort.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
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Navicular is a now understood as being a group of diseases with similar
symptoms.  For most horses, its arthritis of the foot bones and
does respond to bute, regular work, soft ground and corrective footing.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
We had one horse here who had it, essentially from day 1, but put in
many useful years as a hack, school horse and quadrille horse as long
as he had is regular bute regime:  1 gr a day for 5 days, then off
for 2.  He was not ridden on the 'off' days but did go out with
the boys until he managed to fracture his femur (2 months stall rest,
then hand walking, single turnout in the smaller paddock, never looked
back.)#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
The thing with bute is the off time -- to give the horse's system a chance to recover.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
#ed_op#br#ed_cl#
Take it slow, and don't give up.#ed_op#br#ed_cl#